I did not metagame. And I know I did not metagame.

You set up the whole thing ooc and worked most of it OOCLY with people, i'd call that metagaming from the very beginning on your end.

I really hate conflict OOCly, so that's all I wish to say. I'll just leave it up to admins. This is getting too much for me to handle, due to the same accusations being repeated, but only being worded differently.

When you do something wrong and you avoid it, people /have/ to bring it back over and over so you realise you did something wrong. I'm sorry if it annoys you but those accusations are all valid.

Are you supposed to know what I plan to do ICly?

When you basically talk to someone in a way that you're "scripting" a possible RP session, i'd expect to have some semblance of what's going to happen. I'd also expect that you don't do the entire opposite for something that was both unneeded and malicious in it's intent. And no i won't stop using that word, because that's what this is to begin with.

You're not a victim man. Please stop acting like one.

You lied, you misdirected us, you shot us down for no apparent reason other than "supplies" which is not something that's a problem in outlands and misdirected us purposely so we'd break character and have a shot at us. Call me whatever you like, but it'll have to be synonymous to victim.

This is getting stupid and I just really want you to accept that Old Man is pk'd. I've lost characters that I held close to and I also thought they were for bullshit reasons. But in time you will realize how silly it was to get upset about it.

This isn't simply about the PK, it's about you getting away with abusing the rules and misdirecting honest players to get what you want. From day one of this incident you've changed your story more times than some people change shirts, you've used more circular logic than bloody nuns in catholic school and you've gone out of your way to cloud the facts. The metagame many talk about started with you, and ended with you.

but they were Pk'd due to the fact that we can't just forget all that occured on that RP session

Really? There's been several instances for many other characters where PK's were not issued. The third eye event for example. The raid to the Bunker in the pass. The bloody changes of maps. There's been several instances where "you can't just forget" kills happened, and yet nothing was done about it. If you want to talk about this kind of situation we'd have to PK almost the entirety of the outlands, including some of your characters who are currently alive.

I don't understand how stealing items is contraverisal, as one of the main reasons he was killed was for supplies. And may I clarify that it was not the only reason, but one of the reasons he was killed. It doesn't take a long time to notice what Matt has, and it can take an IC assumption to know what he has on him. I mean a guy with Kevlar? And you'd expect him to only have a knife? Back in my backstory for Laurence, he knows that people with kevlar usually mean people with weapons, and he needed more weapons.

The problem is, weren't it for the metagame that you yourself started with this arranged meeting and subsequent attempts to 'butter him up', this meeting would have never happened. ICLY they would never have had a single reason to trust you, and it was solely the fact that you went out of your way OOCLY to fool him into this situation that the whole event happened. And all for some bloody items that are /not/ impossible or rare to find in outlands, let alone the fact that you already HAD items to begin with so you didn't actually require these supplies to begin with, making the assumption that you did this to get more items devolve to one simple term.

Greed

You yourself have stated multiple times that you cannot trust the people in the very group, so why would you go out of your way to give them more shit? you already don't trust them, you do not need them having more firepower to kill you. The influence he had was well isolated to one small part of the map, leaving gigantic parts of the map for you to explore, gain influence over, even seize.
Your vortigaunt is literally eating humans... Why the hell do you trust him?

And finally, the hostility could easily come from anyone. I'd dare say even you have more to worry about hostility wise from the other characters in your little group, which you've said over and over on TS and other means that you do not trust and will eventually part away from in an event you people already have planned.

This whole argument from you reeks of horse-shit.

So anyone can go up to someone, set up something like this in OOC to make people metagame... Then completely get away with it and have it end up in a PK? Does no one else here see the fundamental flaw of this whole thing? It's full to the brim with the possibility (As shown already) of abuse. Anyone could just go and do that to someone who's character they don't like after buttering them up a little and not have a single sanction, not even a slap on the wrist (which would be insultingly minimal for something as malicious as this)

And what does that have to do with this appeal?

He was directly involved in the events. I'd say that has a lot to do with the appeal.

I can't provide those logs as they were over my mobile, BUT I think Frog still has them and can give them to you.

Unless you cleared the chat yourself, Steam Mobile should have the full log (With timestamps if i remember correctly) Meaning that if you take the time you can post the logs in their entirety. Either way even if you did not directly state that you were going to form an alliance you hinted Heavily at it, which just continues on with the point

Quote from: Elions on March 11, 2013, 06:36:55 PM

It kind of is. It prooves he was fooled to go in there, it prooves there was intended malice in fooling him like that, and it's more than obvious that it shows the RP in general was just invalid by the point the whole thing turned around.

So what? That's the point I'm trying to get across, he was fooled and then got a PK from it, so what? It was IC, there's no reason to unPK anyone

... Really? Had i done that to anyone you would be on my ass in a second trying to ban me permanently from the server.

What about the people who could only start this RP with this one precise purpose through OOC measures? That seems to be metagaming as well, but not for using knowledge but by creating it.

And once again Smt, the fact that this whole situation was started through ooc measures means that this was not all ic roleplay, it was not done properly, and it could be argumented that it was done with malicious intent.

Quote from: Statua on March 11, 2013, 04:33:50 PM

So wait. This was planned OOCly? If it was planned OOCly, that means its a scripted RP. You're supposed to follow through with a scripted RP if you want to do that. Otherwise, its just a huge thing of metagame and he said she said.

This was planned ICly as part of our group.

I believe what Statua means is that you did something OOC (Mainly telling him that this was about a completely different matter and that it was all organized to be /solely/ on that matter) to then change the actions completely IC.

Player Section

Steam Name: Elions
Age: 19
How long have you been Roleplaying? (can be any game): About 4 years
How long have you been playing Serious GMod RP?: About 3 years

Character Section

Authorization(s):
- A Five-seveN
- Ammunition for said weapon (2 clips)
- A non-cylindrical silencer for said gun
- Supplies to create defenses for the Outlands (Barriers, signal jammers, explosives, etc.)


Name: Eli 'Harceleur' Valerian
Age: Around 34
Gender: Male
Affiliation: None

Write a detailed in-canon back-story how your character obtained these authorizations.
It was late in the Ineu Valley, Layla was sat quietly in the counter, a cigarrete in her mouth and a mug of acrid coffe sitting by her hand, reading an old, worn out book of pre-war fiction. Eli entered the Inn through the front door, he had been away from the Valley for almost 2 week, possibly more, he looked beaten down, his clothes grimy and torn, sporting fake light OTA gear and carrying a small military grade box with him, as worn and torn as his clothes and his looks

She looked up to him, taking a gulp out of her beverage before saying "Welcome home." Her demeanor almost seemed relaxed, even considering how long it had been since she saw him

"Hey.."
his voice seemed quite tired, sitting down on a chair next to the counter close to her as he put the military box on top of it, he looked like he had just been patched up by Matthew not too long ago.
She looked at him more detainedly, raising an eyebrow at his "OTA" gear, which to the trained eye would have clearly looked fake
"Interesting attire..." she said to him with a non-chalant tone
He looked up at her, sighing as he reclined on his chair "It's a long story, Layla... Believe me."
She quickly tossed her book aside, taking a long drag off her cigarrete before leaning forward and saying
"Better be more interesting than that one."

He raised an eyebrow as she said that, did she expect him to entertain her? Either way, it wasn't like he had anything to do, and certainely nowhere he could go sporting this kind of clothing, not unless he wanted to get shot.
He leaned his head back slightly, taking a deep breath
"Allright, fuck it... You remember I told you all i'd be gone from the pass for some time, right?"

Layla nodded, though her expression showed her disinterest in the story, she took a sip of her coffee, awaiting for him to continue his story.
"Well, I went out looking for Mason Grim. You know, 45's boss. I bet you remember that bastard."
He put a hand over the box in front of him as he told his story, slowly relaxing as he went on
"I figured if anyone had the supplies we need out here to fight off OTA it would be him, and given his 'son' gave us so much trouble he'd maybe help us out."
He relaxed back onto his chair
"Problem was the old bastard was well hidden.. Like... Really well hidden... Only tip I had on him was that he was west of our old location, it was about as helpfull as a glass of water to put out a house fire, but it was something."

Layla frowned as he finished that sentence, a bit confused
"How'd you find him then?"
Eli quickly responded to her question
"I got lucky. I was about to give up looking for him after a week, untill I saw something odd. See, OTA's usual MO for traders is to kill them and incinerate their caravans on sight, right?"
Layla nodded again, letting out an uninterested response "Yeah... I think"
"On my way back I found this trader that was getting raided by the OTA. I stayed back and watched, but they didn't kill him. They just knocked him out and took his shit... They don't really have any need for a caravan full of food and scarce ammo so why would they take it?"
Layla quickly responded to that rethorical question
"Bait... Bribery, perhaps."

"They'd just take people if they needed bait, and traders don't know shit that the OTA don't. So it just left one possibility... That wasn't an OTA patrol"
"Grim's people i assume?"
she quickly put two and two together as he progressed with his story

"Yeah. What better way to hide an organization of spies and military than to make them roleplay as the biggest boogeyman in outlands? Keeps wanna-be heroes away, and people smart enough realise if they can fake that stuff they have to stay at a safe distance."
Layla took a sip of her bitter black coffe, putting the mug back down and gesturing at Eli's clothing
"I guess that explains the fake garb."
He nodded to her a she said that
"Yeah... See, I followed their little patrol, figured they'd lead me right to where Mason was holed up in."
Eli gestured as he continued to talk, describing the location to the best of his abilities
"The place they had set up shop in was an old cave complex. It looked really well built inside, i'd say they had it before the war had even started. They had just painted symbols in places to make it look like an OTA bunker though."
Eli put his hand over the box again, leaning forward slightly
"I wasn't about to pop in unanounced without some sort of confirmation though... Their warehouse and supplies gave it to me though"
*He puts the box on it's side, pointing to a small, smudged but still clear enough to see american flag
"OTA wouldn't allow patriotism for the old countries. Certainely not on active units."
Layla raised an eyebrow at him "I suppose that's true... But get on with the story, will you? I'm getting bored here."

"Heh, allright allright... Been a while since i had to tell a story to anyone." He chuckles lightly as he leaned back, putting his hands to his stomach as he continued with his tale
"I figured if Mason was in there he'd want to talk to me in person, so i wouldn't be in any inmediate danger... So I walked right in, kept my hands up so they knew I didn't have any weapon on me. It was honestly the stupidest idea i've ever had... I mean, i was completely relying on him not seeking revenge on me."

"I figure he would have just killed you there and then, considering what happened with 45." Layla quickly interrupted him, remembering very well what went down during that little confrontation.
"Yeah... Anyhow, as soon as they pulled their weapons up and yelled at me to freeze, everything became quiet... I can only figure that was Mason telling them to not fire through their intercoms or something... It was awkward, to say the least. I could have heard a bloody ant crawling through the floor if there had been one."
He sighed, putting a hand on his forehead, where some bandages seem to cover a deep cut
"One of them knocked me out... Whispered in my ear 'it's for your own safety' right before he did it, without his vocoder on. Next thing i know, i'm in what I could only figure was Mason's office. They took all of my clothes and equipment so i wouldn't do anything unexpected"
He shuddered a little as he mentioned that
"Unrelated note here but... If anyone ever tells you caves aren't cold when you're in them? They're lying through their teeth... Anyhow"
He focused back on the story, thinking back to what happened.
"Turns out he simply wanted to meet his prodigy's long lost brother or some cooked up shit like that... I told him what I had come looking for, and what 45 had done to us... He didn't even flinch while i told him what the fucker did, I think he already knew what kind of power hungry bastard he was"
His voice seemed tired, even melancholic as he talked about Mason and his reactions
"He had a different idea for me though... He wanted to recruit me. I figure that he couldn't find a better replacement for his 'prodigy' agent than the man who tracked him down and killed him"
He patted the side of the OTA shirt, where the symbol was placed
"I didn't have much of a choice really. I had to play along for the moment and figure out a way to get out later. They treated me really nice, i'll give them that... Soon as I got out of his office they gave me clothes and a place to stay... And this thing"
He knocked with his knuckles on the box lightly, turning it around so Layla could open it, as he figured she'd be curious.

She opened the box, inside there was a Five-seveN, with 2 magazines and their correspondent ammunition, as well as one non-cylindrical silencer
She took it in her hands to inspect it a bit as Eli continued to talk
"He told me it was 45's old gun. He had left it behind when he went rogue since it was a gift from Mason. I guess he wasn't as emotioless as he tried to look like."
"Impressive piece..." She said as she inspected the weapon, looking up at him after putting it back in the box "How'd you get out of there with it?"
"Wasn't precisely easy..." he rubbed the back of his head as he talked "I had to first make them comfortable in my presence, so I had to stick around for a few more days. Make them think I had been convinced by Mason that being one of their agents was for the best"
"Did he?"
He looked up at her, his expression was stiff, almost as if to say 'really? You're asking me that?' without saying a word. She quickly decided to do ask something else to not continue the awkward moment.

"I take it you fought your way out during a patrol, right?
"Not precisely. I figured it was better if they didn't think it was my fault, so I went out with one of their groups to raid a trader, I convinced them to let me take care of him 'personally' since he had been giving us some issues"
"Sounds logical enough"

"I went and knocked him out behind a corner" He made a slight gesture, almost mimicking the action of hitting someone over the head
"So no one would think i had chickened out i let a couple of shots out... Then i hid one of those old combine transmitters on him, you know, those they give to loyalists so they can call for help when they need it?"
She nodded to him as she crossed her arms
"Request devices, yeah... They're fitted with short range transmitters aren't they?"

"Mhm... They can still get picked up even out here if a scanner passes by. Anyhow, i left him a note, told him in it that if he used that transmitter close to that cave when a scanner passed by, all of his troubles would be taken care of, no more stolen goods, no more shitty OTA raids, nothing.
It took a couple of days, but one night i got woken up by Mason, they were moving the base. Apparently my little plan had worked but they somehow picked up the signal too, and they weren't about to risk OTA taking a quick look at their fake base."
He took a moment to rest his tongue, sighing deeply as he adjusted himself in his chair again
"They sent a small number of blokes up to distract the real OTA while we moved everything. I had to move part of the warehouse with 3 other people. We all took very different routes, mainly so that if one group was caught the rest could continue on. I waited untill we were too far away for the radio to communicate us properly, then I made my move..."

He patted part of the OTA shirt which seemed to be burned off
"The body armour they gave me was pretty good but i still took a few harsh hits... still, we all had the same gear at the moment so i wasn't at a disadvantage. I used the darkness and the surprise factor to take them all out quick. It worked but i ended up breaking the Bio-locked M4 they gave me... It was a piece of crap anyhow. Bloody yank guns..."
*Ahem*
"I made sure to dispose of their bodies and hide the shit I wasn't able to carry back with me. So I ended up bringing some of the crates here and the gun... As far as I know, Mason hasn't reached his destination yet, but I figure it won't take him long to put two and two together once he notices i'm not there... I can't say i care though, I got what we needed and made it out alive. Speaking of, Matt should be getting back with the rest of the supplies sometime soon now... He had the vehicle after all. I think you'll want to check out the stuff too."
"That depends on what it is"
Layla answered quickly, her eyes showing a light glimmer of expectancy as he said that
"Mostly stuff to build defenses of all sorts, explosives and reinforcement stuff, it all has to be put together and constructed, and it's old as fuck... But it's better than nothing. There were some old signal jammers in there too, I figure you'll have some fun with those."
As he finished that sentence, they both could hear a car outside, it was Matthew who had just arrived with the rest of the supplies
"Like clockwork... Want to go take a look?"
Layla nodded, putting her finished mug of coffee down as she got up, as she walked towards the door she realised Eli hadn't moved yet "You coming or what?"

He smiled lightly "Just give me a minute... I'm still recovering after all."
As she left, Eli turned the box that held the gun around, so he could get a good look at it.
He stared at it for a good few seconds, Layla's question of wether Mason had actually convinced him to be his ally was effective or not... He took an old emblem from inside the box, a worn down red and black star, putting it into his pocket. He closed the box as he looked back up again, Matthew standing by the door as he yelled
"Come on, Eli! I'm not carrying these all by myself!-"

He nodded to him as he got up, muttering in a low voice to himself "... We needed this... Just remember that..." He walked towards the door, with the intention to help his friend set up the supplies inside the Inn.






What will these authorizations give your character in regards to perks or defects?
Perks
- The Five-seveN is an armor-piercing weapon (even with normal ammunition) making it ideal for wounding/taking out targets that have armour on them
- The silencer means that Eli will be able to maintain a low profile while using the gun
- The supplies will allow the small group that Eli is part of in outlands to reinforce and create traps in the town or other key places, making it easier for them to survive or repell a OTA raid

Defects
- The weapon's ammunition is not precisely common, since the Five-seveN uses the same kind of caliber as a p90 (5.7x28mm) meaning obtaining more ammunition for it ICLY requires a bit more difficult scavenging than normal, this means that he will keep his usage of the weapon sparse.
- The silencer makes it a hard to conceal weapon, though it certainely helps him keep stealthy in a sneaking situation, it is not a weapon he can hide when in plain sight or in public, not without some help.
- As described in the Auth, the supplies are not of the best quality, and they are all broken down or require assembling, this means that setting up the traps and assorted helping items will require some help from other characters that HAVE some experience with mechanics and electronics.

What do you plan to do with these perks/defects?
The gun is to help Eli be a bit more of a help during OTA raids or against enemies that are armed, the short range of a pistol in combination with his CQC experience could be very helpfull for certain situations and would allow for him to help defend the small group he works with more efficiently against raiders, bandits, etc.

The supplies to defend the town will be used to set up traps or defenses to keep people inside and outside safe, as well as dether any kind of attack that could come onto them, he's looking for a way to make a proper settlement that can stand up to more focused attacks by other groups like the OTA.

Will anyone else need these auths? (If so, list OOC and IC name(s))
As the items are worked on to set them up, auths will be put up by the characters/players that are setting them up, the supplies then are basically an auth that will be used by the small group in the Inn in general.

The Five-seveN is property solely to Eli.

Which server does this apply for?
Outlands

Extra Notes (optional):
For information on Mason Grimm, and his organization/how he is able to maintain these items, you can look onto this old application which explains his old affiliation. http://www.catalyst-gaming.net/index.php?topic=15983.0